Author Topic: B-plan: callygraphy incorporated into 3D, architecture related project  (Read 27411 times)

November 24, 2013, 06:13:25 PM
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Lazur

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Starting this topic because the other wip topics I made on this project at inkscapeforum seem to went out of direction.
That is because overcomplicating the things leaded straight to problems where I got stuck.
Even that, some may be interested in stages already been reached, and what else to come.



Short description:

To finish my studies in architecture I was forced to abandone the project I chose and was said to better have a "B-plan".
So I was thinking, what if those words would be taken literally .
Let's make a building in the shape of a "B".

This idea is not so groundbreaking one, as there are a few examples for buildings on the letter subject, most notably
Steingruber's alphabet.

The full alphabet:




Letter "B" from that alphabet:


My idea was, to have the basic letter structure clean, before adding the technical details -like walls and an actual function...
-On a side note, there was no problem with l'art pour l'art designing for the scool.
As long as I went with the idea, it was meant to be a hangar like building, with many possible functions
but at this stage I'm focusing on that "?" mark added to the design, as the others are way too complicated to make it right. 
No real problem though with the idea, as the place the building should be designed includes it in the name too.


Thus took a jump into typography and calligraphy.
And how they differ.



This form is tend to look geometric, and be able to be reconstructed from individual pulled strokes.
Speaking of architecture, this would need to have a pen shape in 3D that would taper a line and it's hull would result in the strokes.

On the calligraphy side, for this particular project the pen shape would only be translated, so
no scaling and rotating is involved, even though they might be considered if it ever evolves.
It's just one letter, but it may raise some interest in others on how to incorporate calligraphy in the world of 2D and 3D vector arts as a "live" object. 


Edit:

here are previous threads started on the same idea

Thom's egg calligraphy
inkscape 2D - blender 3d
transformation matrix

3D calligraphy problem discussion
modelling the ?
modelling the ? II
modelling the ? III
unwrapping the frame structure
-this was totally remodelled from scratch-
« Last Edit: December 17, 2013, 10:52:15 PM by Lazur »

November 25, 2013, 08:42:15 AM
Reply #1

Lazur

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« Last Edit: November 25, 2013, 06:51:04 PM by Lazur »

November 25, 2013, 06:49:40 PM
Reply #2

Lazur

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« Last Edit: November 25, 2013, 07:47:19 PM by Lazur »

November 25, 2013, 06:54:43 PM
Reply #3

Lazur

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« Last Edit: November 25, 2013, 07:47:45 PM by Lazur »

November 25, 2013, 07:01:36 PM
Reply #4

Lazur

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This one is the built up letter as a full shape:





The idea behind the fill was to avoid a "double line" layout look,
which renaissance letter constructions widely used.
For an example, here is an illustration of Alberti's "B":





There was no blurring or gradient mesh used, just simple gradients.




Here is the original svg:
http://inkscapecommunity.com/ic_gallery/albums/userpics/10014/f82~0.svg

Also here is the original svg of the last, fully covered black stroke version:
http://inkscapecommunity.com/ic_gallery/albums/userpics/10014/f62~0.svg

Couldn't get it to be rendered right when saved as a pdf, or if just viewed with a browser.

December 08, 2013, 04:45:24 PM
Reply #5

Lazur

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Moved on a bit with the project, into the less calligraphic based part with that "?"mark.
Here is an animation of the basic core of the building on it's cross-sections:


Considering to start a work in progress topic at blenderartist forum.
Even this part is close to it's finish, the original "calligraphy" part will be a long way if ever.
Now on can come plans of the tower, and 3D renders from blender.

December 08, 2013, 07:13:55 PM
Reply #6

Lazur

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Another slideshow from the previous models, this time all rotated until the cut is parallel with the camera.

December 08, 2013, 07:38:25 PM
Reply #7

brynn

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Now with that animation, I have a better idea what you're doing.  But now that better understanding brings up another question.  Why does the building design need to shown or drawn like one would draw a letter or character?  In some of your previous messages, it was important which strokes were made.  And I had the idea that the order of the strokes mattered too.  This animation indicates the circle drawn in only 1 stroke.  Maybe the part about the strokes taken when drawing the character is part of the....linguistic off-shoot from your main architectural project?

Or were you thinking of creating the building design sort of like the example with the massive amount of tiny circles, where each circle might represent a room in the building, and/or maybe hallways?  I can imagine an animation where the rooms are popping into view (from nowhere) and then are laid down and stacked up until the building is complete.  Kind of a playful thought, I guess.  And no doubt entirely unrealistic, as far as architecture, lol.

I'm glad to see your work is moving along.  Oh, also I love the spiral staircase!
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December 08, 2013, 09:00:05 PM
Reply #8

Lazur

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That's right, the calligraphic part was just about how to create the "hull" if it was done in an elegant way, and in 2D.
The degree mark was drawn by 2 strokes because if drawn by hand, started at the top, moving clockwise, the pen would be pulled and not pushed at the left part, which is better be avoided.
Also, the connection between the strokes have some gaps added. If the pen shape was added next to the other previous stroke's edge, touching it, then it would probably be crossing it already on paper -and it would produce rendering issues in the svg by the anti-aliasing.
The 3D calligraphed strokes would have a bit simpler cores on the "B" part, because if a 3D pen shape would be moved along those lines from start to end which the 2D letter was drawn, there would be gaps on the top between them.

More than that, the architectural part is just an "illumination" of the characters.
The linguistic off-shoot is right too, but gladly it has evolved with that simpler circular form to another symbolic level.
Round and round in circle till' the finish. It has going along for too long time now.

If those tiny circles would be separate rooms in that previous image, then it would be a much larger scaled building.
Something would likely have.
At the place it has to be designed it is too large for a human scale with the "B" part's current size.
-The pen shape is 5,5/27,5m wide and 14m tall.-
And always too large for not having a reasonable function.
More of a technical challenge then a nice building.


That staircase was designed for it's look too. As it was cut out from the inner edge of a giant ring.
But, that results the ceiling above the staircase is a huge console holding only itself -if it could-,
which resulted in the structure presented above.
If it was only about to go up, the stairs could be held by their sides only, and pre-made parts could be used.
Now they are held by walls going in a radial direction. Not so effective statically, not so effective on the construction side.


There will be a shading grid above this tower, making the "eye candy" to it's fullness.
Modelled half a dosen already, the next one will be the final.
That part is designed with inkscape, will upload how it was done, maybe?
It would be probably the only really "work in progress" stage part of the architectural project.
Don't count on it soon, representing the idea seems taking at least two times more than just making the final version with it.
Remember that iso-line construction that I was making in this topic?
I was planning to draw an illustration on that in axonometry.
And some more imagery on the 3D pen shape for this ongoing project.
And now started over the calligraphic part a bit from the basics, and got a new idea on redefining typography if ever.
Even I still haven't looked up Gerrit Noordzij's book.
39 days left for finishing the plans to their fullness. What a great time is coming along!

December 09, 2013, 12:18:01 AM
Reply #9

brynn

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39 days?  Is this for a class/course?  Or thesis?

"That staircase was designed for it's look too. As it was cut out from the inner edge of a giant ring.
But, that results the ceiling above the staircase is a huge console holding only itself -if it could-,
which resulted in the structure presented above.
If it was only about to go up, the stairs could be held by their sides only, and pre-made parts could be used.
Now they are held by walls going in a radial direction. Not so effective statically, not so effective on the construction side. " 

Cantilever (Frank Lloyd Wright?), if I understand correctly what it is, and if stairs can even be made by cantilever, the inner wall could be eliminated.  Make ceiling a glass (or some translucent material) dome!  Huge inner atrium, giant garden in the middle, like a greenhouse, with very tall plants, even a tree, with offices hidden behind the wall which holds the cantilevered stairs.  Outdoors (garden) is on inside, indoors (office) is on outside, of the circle!

Don't let me take the subject too far off topic.  I'm just exercising my imagination  0:)   Plus, that's the full extent of my knowledge of architecture, lol!
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December 17, 2013, 08:39:59 PM
Reply #10

Lazur

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The previous posts may have been two step forwards, and important parts were missing.
Time to learn how to showcase design process right sometime.

Anyway, moving forward by coming from.

Here is a rendering of the 3D pen shape that is used on the "B" part:





Here is a sketch of the taper of the strokes forming the 3D letter shape:







The degree mark uses a much simpler shape as a counterpoint (Am I using the right word for that? Trying to catch up with Noordzij's terminology.),
resulting the taper shape is made up of two cilinders and a half torus.



The model images in the previous posts showed the basic structure inside that taper shape.
Which is, formed by an outside shading structure made of steel rods.


That being said, here are some images, checking out different camera angles.
The scene would need some improvements like adding a better lighting set though.








a closeup of the entrance















This is for thesis.
In the end all images made will be displayed in A1 size prints.
Not so happy with the current model images.
There is a need to add elevation plans and the sides showing North and West are consisting the black painted steel on black concrete, with no direct light, resulting only in a black shape.
Also, these models have the rods made from a texture made with inkscape previously, thus it has 0 width, and doesn't show up at it's sides.
Made another model with each rod modelled, but the facecount has to be adjusted further on.
Too much faces to be handled, and blender just quits before rendering.

 
The design is much smaller than that being possible with the tree or with offices.
Sure there are alot of unused space, but that's all for "creating the look".
Without that clean geometry of the staircase -the ceiling part of it-, all of it could be less painfully.
« Last Edit: December 18, 2013, 07:21:01 AM by Lazur »

December 18, 2013, 08:22:38 AM
Reply #11

brynn

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Well, I can't add much to the thesis  :no2: .  But just some comments from an un-architectural-educated observer.  In the first b/w image showing the rod structure/model:

 -- having created hundreds of spirograms with Inkscape's Spirograph extension, the rod structure looks quite reminiscent of a spirogram....let me find example.... 

 -- maybe this is what you mean by better lighting, but it looks like the shadows of the rod structure interferes with viewing the structure itself...maybe if the shadow were in a different color than gray, it might help the black rods show up better...or maybe a version with no shadow?

It looks like a really cool building!  Can't wait to see final draft.   :)
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December 18, 2013, 01:44:01 PM
Reply #12

Lazur

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The funny thing is I never drew a spirograph image with that inkscape extension.
Only used the parametric curves extension to draw something similar to it.

The sprograph makes hypotrochoids and epitrochoids, one continuous rotationally symmetric line.
The rods in the building are not bent in one continuous line, but in a helix shape at the cilindrical parts of the taper object.
Which results in somekind of logarithmic spirals.
Even if looks similar, that is an important difference.

The geometry was made to have that look in the entrance, and a clean topview.

As, it looks like a giant square mesh is streched diagonally.
That is only possible if the helixes elevate at constant 45? at the inner and outer cilinder surfaces.
Another idea was, to have 12 rods in each direction, and, adding them a continuous transition at the taper's top -torus- part.

At the entrance, the inner and outer "squares" look center-aligned to it.
That means each rod is bent from the entrance's axis level -at 1,65m above the ground-,
in the defined axis in the helixes, until at after a 180? turn around the building central axis, they reach that same 1,65m height, on the other side of the building.
That defines the helix part well, but there could be many ways to connect the helixes on the torus part.
Previously made at least 5 different models for that.


On the modelling and rendering, I'm facing some issues too.
http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?320784-white-edge-casted-on-transparent-texture

Oiriginally I was trying to make small rods from a plain texture, as on these images above, but
that means, at the sides they almost disappear, while, there they should look more dense.
Made another model, with each rod from a separate curve.
But that, with a 14 resolution given, results the model to have an enermous 10^9 number of faces.
Which crashes blender at rendering.

December 18, 2013, 08:03:59 PM
Reply #13

Lazur

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Found the old and previously unfinished model of the "counterpoint" shape used for the "B"-s 3D strokes.
Since then discovered the looptool's bridge addon in blender, which made it possible to finish this set in no time:
 

The faces materials are showing the topology, no unwrapping and texturing was included.
The model in the centre and in the right are the same but with different colouring.

It was based on the isolines constructed in inkscape.
There arose the problem: how to construct nodes on the path with exact tangent directions.
As if those cutlines had their nodes as described, the model on the right would be perfect for further modelling any accurate taper objects
with translational moving along paths in horizontal surfaces.

December 20, 2013, 10:09:21 PM
Reply #14

Lazur

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Made a topview plan of the steel structure:


On this view the helix parts are looking as circles, the transitional toroid parts are adding that possible trochoid feel.
The main direction follows the inner and outer circles tangentially, and, the intersecting points at the top of the steel structure are placed exactly above the centerline of the torus shape.
That, and the fact that the transition between the helixes follow the helixes starting and end tangent's direction -which were both set to be 45?-, makes it an irregular toroid line.

This is an svg version, you can download it and zoom in for the details.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2014, 01:18:03 PM by Lazur »

January 07, 2014, 10:46:23 AM
Reply #15

Lazur

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Other svg-s showing sideviews of the basic steel structure below.
Some modifications will be at the entrance of the building and at the entrance of the staircase.














Don't know if it's a good idea to put these under a calligraphic-related gallery folder as they are related less to the title.
Considering to divide it to two parts, not sure yet.
« Last Edit: January 07, 2014, 12:17:11 PM by Lazur »

January 13, 2014, 02:11:32 PM
Reply #16

Lazur

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Sideviews made with cilindrical projections from the inside and the outside:






One thing that is off though: the rods should have different widths at the two sides with this projection.
On these, the front parts have the correct widths, the others would be thinner on the inside view, and wider on the view from outside.

January 20, 2014, 12:29:53 PM
Reply #17

Lazur

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Now that I couldn't keep the deadline, I have to reorganise and think over the project.
The main focus is held at the tower part with the degree symbol look, making the other unnecessary.
More than that, it has it's own meaning.
Oh wait, B? can refer to Balling:

Quote (selected)
BALLING

Balling. (bohl'-ling)
    1. A type of saccharometer devised by Carl Joseph Napoleon Balling in 1843. Balling noticed that the extract in wort increased the density of the wort in almost the same proportion as saccharose increased the density of water. He prepared solutions of saccharose and computed tables giving the extract content based on the density of the wort. The Balling saccharometer is graduated in grams per hundred (or percent) so as to give a direct reading of the percentage of extract by weight per 100 grams of solution and is calibrated for use at 63.5 ?F (17.5 ?C). (Example: 10 ?B equals 10 grams of sugar per 100 grams of wort.) Pale ales commonly tend to be around 13.5 ?B and porters around 12.5 ?B. On the specific gravity scale, 1 ?B equals 3.8 points. Because the reading gives the percentage extract by weight, it must be multiplied by the specific gravity to obtain the percentage weight per 100 milliliters. The tables computed by Balling were slightly erroneous but were corrected by Plato around 1900. Balling also devised the following formula to calculate the original extract of a beer from its alcohol content and terminal (or true) gravity:
E = [(2.665 ? A + n ) ? 100] / (100 + 1.0665 ? A)
E = original extract
n = true extract of the beer
A = percent weight of alcohol
2. Balling (degree). A measure on the Balling saccharometer. Abbrev: ?B. See also: Brix; Plato.

http://wiki.homebrewersassociation.org/Balling



The area is too small for a brewing factory, nor would it be a good idea to add a lookaround tower right next to it as it was planned.
Nor would it be fine typographically, most serif font's degree symbol I could find doesn't go that high (and not even in the proportions of the letters sadly).

Quote (selected)
History

The first known recorded modern use of the degree symbol in mathematics is from 1569[2] where the usage seems to show that the symbol is a small raised zero, to match the prime symbol notation of sexagesimal subdivisions of degree such as minute ′, second ″, and tertia ‴ which originates as small raised Roman numerals.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degree_symbol

Quote (selected)
The word zero came via French z?ro from Venetian zero, which (together with cypher) came via Italian zefiro from Arabic صفر, ṣafira = "it was empty", ṣifr = "zero", "nothing". The first known English use was in 1598.[4][5][6][7]
In 976 AD the Persian encyclopedist Muhammad ibn Ahmad al-Khwarizmi, in his "Keys of the Sciences", remarked that if, in a calculation, no number appears in the place of tens, then a little circle should be used "to keep the rows". This circle was called صفر (ṣifr, "empty") in Arabic language. That was the earliest mention of the name ṣifr that eventually became zero.[8]
Italian zefiro already meant "west wind" from Latin and Greek zephyrus; this may have influenced the spelling when transcribing Arabic ṣifr.[9] The Italian mathematician Fibonacci (c.1170–1250), who grew up in North Africa and is credited with introducing the decimal system to Europe, used the term zephyrum. This became zefiro in Italian, which was contracted to zero in Venetian.
As the decimal zero and its new mathematics spread from the Arabic world to Europe in the Middle Ages, words derived from ṣifr and zephyrus came to refer to calculation, as well as to privileged knowledge and secret codes. According to Ifrah, "in thirteenth-century Paris, a 'worthless fellow' was called a '... cifre en algorisme', i.e., an 'arithmetical nothing'."[9] From ṣifr also came French chiffre = "digit", "figure", "number", chiffrer = "to calculate or compute", chiffr? = "encrypted". Today, the word in Arabic is still ṣifr, and cognates of ṣifr are common in the languages of Europe and southwest Asia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero



So let's divide it by two, and/or by zero.
Will manage to make a calligraphy/3D lettering/Steingruber alphabet lookalike topic, if it ever reaches some level,
and a separate one for this building.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2014, 02:05:54 PM by Lazur »

January 20, 2014, 01:55:26 PM
Reply #18

brynn

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Missed the deadline? That's too bad!  Especially since it was already "Plan B"  :uhoh:

Out of curiosity, (which is all I really have to offer, lol) what are the outer dimensions of this tiny circle building?  Why do you think of the tiny circle as a degree sign, rather than a zero, for example, or letter o (or wheel, or clockface, or cross section of a cylinder, or the orbit of hydrogen's single electron, etc., etc.)?  (Although I guess technically, hydrogen's electron's path isn't really 2 dimensional, now that I think about it.  ....but then, neither is a building 2 dimensional....)  Are the outer dimensions part of the "rules" of the project?

And another curiosity.  I notice the top (roof) of the building is nearly flat, but still slightly rounded.  Is it just that you like how it looks, or does it have some functional purpose (like rain/snowmelt runoff)?  Could it be completely flat, with a sharp, 90 drop-off along edges?  Or the other extreme, could it be completely rounded, like what I understand is a true toroid?

You might have mentioned this before, but I don't remember.  Is it going to have windows?
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January 20, 2014, 03:53:04 PM
Reply #19

Lazur

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The base unit of the grid it was made on is 5,5m, making the outer edge of the steel structure have a 27,5m diameter.
It doesn't have any real practical function, simply casting shadows and holding back the ouroboros beneath.
The width of the concrete part is 4,4m, with the staircase being 2,2m in width.
There were some restrictions, which are all fine except for the height of the building.
As it won't be built, it's not a real problem.

The reason why I refer to it as a degree mark because it makes it clearer that it is tend to be a symbol itself.
More than that, the design area is containing "fok" in it's name, which means degree too in hungarian.
And, the local mayor office had the conception to add a symbol that could be distinguished as the gate of the district.
(There was a pdf somewhere on the net with rendered images of their other conception, office buildings...)

The shape of the roof part forms a torus; every bit is rounded.
The rods don't follow a regular toroid though, because the starting and ending tangents of the axises at the thorus parts differ from that.

It won't have any windows, nor any functional interior.


February 14, 2014, 04:26:44 PM
Reply #20

Lazur

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Going back to the building site:



via bingmap


Full sized view of the area:

google
satellite
hybrid
map

bing
aerial
with labels
map


The bing aerial looks better than google's, but google's map shows the bicycle road which is mistaken even on the official plans below.

Local master plan from the district's page:

detailed drawing from a cad program, but an ugly pdf

A cleaned svg version of the master plan:

Will scale it up until the numbers will be legible if possible.

The mentioned site had other pdf-s before, one containing this part of the map, with isolines included but in a raster format.
So much for 3D representation.

February 15, 2014, 01:18:42 PM
Reply #21

brynn

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All of these dropbox links are showing blank pages for me (Firefox):

Full sized view of the area:

google
satellite
hybrid
map

bing
aerial
with labels
map
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February 15, 2014, 04:36:57 PM
Reply #22

Lazur

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Thank's for checking it!
Dropbox is getting more issues while there is too much space used?

Attached is a zipped folder with the 6 html pages.
If it was possible and me knowing how, I would have embedded some of the <iframe>-s they are containing here.

February 15, 2014, 06:33:04 PM
Reply #23

brynn

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Off topic, but there are plenty of other image hosts.  Image Shack allows you to have accounts to manage your images, and to keep your images private.  Their servers seem to break down a lot (so now and then I would have to reupload certain images), but for free, it's not bad.  So far, I have not come up against any limits, and I'd guess I have at least 200 images hosted there...oh gosh, I haven't looked at my accounts in over a year, and when I went to get a general idea how many images I have, I see that they've totally redesigned their system!  It looks much nicer!).  Maybe some others have accounts too, I'm not sure.  I think imgur is reputable, but don't know if you can have your own account.  I know that imgh.us does not offer user accounts, but they're the only host I know that accepts SVG.

I don't know much about iframes either.  I think it is part of html, which is not allowed in messages, for security reasons.


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February 15, 2014, 07:12:32 PM
Reply #24

Lazur

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Those iframes are used for embedding a part of the map hosted at google/bing.
It's not containing one single image, it renders live from images at their servers.
They were set with parameters that they show up a 3000/6000 pixel part at 20 zoom level at the exact positions.
Then  a screengrab-like extension of the browser can save it as a png, but why to use up so much space just to show them online.
Not that it wouldn't go against copyright laws? Didn't check it.

So it was just some simple html files to be hosted, not images this time.
Had a long list of free image hosts somewhere, most of them went offline.
As far as I remember deviantart can host svg-s too, but there are too many ads displayed there and the uploading needs too much action.

The free dropbox space is 2 GB, which I used up mostly by uploading a zipped archive of the project at an earlier stage.
Now trying to sort out as it is getting out of order.
2878 files, 6,7 GB space is used currently, with all the backups.
The calligraphic part, with the 3D "B" letter is taking up 1170 files and 2,1 GB itself -which, with this direction will be missed out nearly in it's fullness. Something definitely should be made from those later.